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  • kiwidave Posts: 2867
    Melbourne
    Forum Legend kiwidave
    17 Jun 2017 02:50 PM
    There actually is a stock hole on mine, but then it is an oddball 1985 4spd with unique tweaked Shovel frame.  The hole / Allen key procedure is referred to in the factory manual.  
  • Adz69 Posts: 181
    Central Coast NSW
    Stock Poster Adz69
    17 Jun 2017 09:08 PM
    This is a really informative thread. It's great to check out the pics too. I like the cut down allen key tool...necessity is the mother of invention. 
  • John.R Posts: 203
    Stock Poster John.R
    17 Jun 2017 10:29 PM
    Posted by kiwidave on 17 Jun 2017 02:20 PM
    There actually is a stock hole on mine, but then it is an oddball 1985 4spd with unique tweaked Shovel frame.  The hole / Allen key procedure is referred to in the factory manual.  

     On an FXR frame? Interesting, my frame is technically a shovel frame but differences are limited. 

  • 05WG Posts: 50
    Stock Poster 05WG
    18 Jun 2017 08:00 PM
    Posted by John.R on 17 Jun 2017 09:59 PM
    Posted by kiwidave on 17 Jun 2017 02:20 PM
    There actually is a stock hole on mine, but then it is an oddball 1985 4spd with unique tweaked Shovel frame.  The hole / Allen key procedure is referred to in the factory manual.  

     On an FXR frame? Interesting, my frame is technically a shovel frame but differences are limited. 

     Not sure what model Kiwidave has. But my 1985 FXWG has both the hole and the reference in the factory manual. Though my manual does not cover the FXR model. And yours is an '86 model.

  • John.R Posts: 203
    Stock Poster John.R
    18 Jun 2017 08:48 PM
    Posted by 05WG on 18 Jun 2017 07:30  

      But my 1985 FXWG has both the hole and the reference in the factory manual. Though my manual does not cover the FXR model. And yours is an '86 model.

     Yeah different frames,bikes and FSMs.

     What makes you think mines an 86?

  • kiwidave Posts: 2867
    Melbourne
    Forum Legend kiwidave
    19 Jun 2017 09:57 AM
    Mine is 1985 FXEF 4spd Evo. 
  • 05WG Posts: 50
    Stock Poster 05WG
    19 Jun 2017 07:04 PM
    Posted by John.R on 18 Jun 2017 08:18 PM
    Posted by 05WG on 18 Jun 2017 07:30  

      But my 1985 FXWG has both the hole and the reference in the factory manual. Though my manual does not cover the FXR model. And yours is an '86 model.

     Yeah different frames,bikes and FSMs.

     What makes you think mines an 86?

     Original post stated "Engine is an 86 with unknown KM's". Sounds like I jumped to the wrong conclusion :-)

  • John.R Posts: 203
    Stock Poster John.R
    19 Jun 2017 08:28 PM
    Heads dropped off to local shop today, he'll go through em let me know what needs to replaced, no hurry on em though. I just need to give him the valve seals when I get my gasket kit.

    Any preferences between Cometic and James? It had a james kit in, withno dramas, but hear Cometic is just as popular?

    Still trying pin down a pair of nice cylinders, otherwise it looks like ill probably just end up with the S&S replacement kit, which comes with 10:1 pistons anyway. Only problem is ive gotta wait till my parents go to the states in a month to get em.
  • perthhog Posts: 1519
    Motor Head perthhog
    21 Jun 2017 05:11 PM
    Ok I'll throw it out there good going with your made tool , evo softails have a hole in the frame for the said bolt as do the 
    Aftermarket kraftech frames , I had a chuckle at what Dave said about the bolt getting lost down into frame I remember 
    Back to when I had one of frames re powder coated and had the frame at hm blowing out all the excess sand that was 
    In the frame from being sandblasted  before I started to assemble it back together and a rocker cover bolt come
    Flying out of a frame hole lol   And snapon and probley others do make a spanner for the rocker cover bolts I'm lucky 
    I grabbed one years ago of flebay
  • tussuck Posts: 1270
    Melbourne
    Performance Poster tussuck
    22 Jun 2017 12:05 PM
    Both James and Cometic are good gasket kits.  I tend to go with James but that's mainly habit and availability... The key thing with either set of head gaskets is to follow their instructions and not the ones in the harley manual (I buy the MLS ones which are basically a laminated one and so have different torque needs)
  • John.R Posts: 203
    Stock Poster John.R
    22 Jun 2017 06:25 PM
    Posted by tussuck on 22 Jun 2017 12:05 PM
    Both James and Cometic are good gasket kits.  I tend to go with James but that's mainly habit and availability... The key thing with either set of head gaskets is to follow their instructions and not the ones in the harley manual (I buy the MLS ones which are basically a laminated one and so have different torque needs)

     

    I think those are the ones that where in it.

    Like a rubberized metal gasket with orange sealing 'line' for want of a better word? And base and head gaskets with a metal ring around em.

    I'll try and get those again, hopefully they all come in 1 convenient kit lol

  • John.R Posts: 203
    Stock Poster John.R
    03 Jul 2017 11:23 AM

    Opened the cam chest up on the weekend, and surprised to find a TP engineering steel breather gear...

    Even weirder is that is has no screen on it. Luckily the bore is std size and in good nick, so the  S&S one has been slotted in.

    Not surprised to find the stock cam in it though haha. I think I've decided on the EV46.

    Ill swap the bearing out soon, its already got a Torrington in it which is good, but just swapping out anyway.



    HD Forums Australia - cam.jpg

  • tussuck Posts: 1270
    Melbourne
    Performance Poster tussuck
    09 Jul 2017 10:02 PM
    Looks good!.  I run an S&S valve breather so do not have to worry about syncing any timing slots.  You could 'time' the hole and resize it to be 100% with the piston downstroke but its a bit wanky for almost no gain.

    Suggest you press off the old gear from the cam and press onto the EV46 as then you do not have to worry about setting the correct gear lash etc (and its bloody important to do!).  Its very easy to do.

    Also dry fit the cam and make sure that the inner most cam lob DOES NOT hit the inner case (there is a lip in there at the back).  For my EV3 I had to grind out a small section to provide the clearance.  Just pull the old cam and put in the new one and see if you can turn it a full 360 degrees by hand - if the lip is there you will feel it thats for sure.  

    Finally make sure you buy the correct gaskets!  there are 2 types that look almost identical but if you put the wrong one into an early EVO it will piss oil out everywhere when you start it up (do not ask how I know this one ,, lol)
  • John.R Posts: 203
    Stock Poster John.R
    16 Jul 2017 05:08 PM
    Posted by tussuck on 09 Jul 2017 10:02 PM
    Looks good!.  I run an S&S valve breather so do not have to worry about syncing any timing slots.  You could 'time' the hole and resize it to be 100% with the piston downstroke but its a bit wanky for almost no gain.

    Suggest you press off the old gear from the cam and press onto the EV46 as then you do not have to worry about setting the correct gear lash etc (and its bloody important to do!).  Its very easy to do.

    Also dry fit the cam and make sure that the inner most cam lob DOES NOT hit the inner case (there is a lip in there at the back).  For my EV3 I had to grind out a small section to provide the clearance.  Just pull the old cam and put in the new one and see if you can turn it a full 360 degrees by hand - if the lip is there you will feel it thats for sure.  

    Finally make sure you buy the correct gaskets!  there are 2 types that look almost identical but if you put the wrong one into an early EVO it will piss oil out everywhere when you start it up (do not ask how I know this one ,, lol)

     Thank you for the tips. 

    Not sure the gear swap will be necessary, but will scope it out when It gets here. I was just reading through the Andrews instructions and they detail the specs for the lash so will scope it all out. I actually hadn't considered (or even heard anyone else mention it) till your post and then reading the instructions.

    As for cam fitment, it'll definitely be dry fitted up to check clearances and shim sizes. Which is also important since mines an 86 and is apparently slightly different after that year?

    As for gaskets, once I get my shit together and get a list ill buy em all from rollies. I think I've got the part numbers right according to James Catalogue:

    https://www.jamesgaskets.com/product/jgi-17033-83-mls/


    Not much to update, I've put together an ever growing list of shit for my parents to get from the states for me when they go next month:


    HD Forums Australia - jporder.jpg

    I pulled the old cam bearing out without drama the other night so will replace that soon enough.

    I need to start measuring up the bits and peices to ensure everything is in spec and doesnt need to be replaced and added to the order. 

    Im starting to clean up the alloy too, not a fan of chrome so it will end up being brushed alloy.

  • tussuck Posts: 1270
    Melbourne
    Performance Poster tussuck
    16 Jul 2017 09:49 PM
    Yep, that's the right James top end Gasket kit (it comes with the washers for the covers so you do not need to order them separately) - the MLS ones are pretty bullet proof (I run the same on my turbo engine without any issues)

    Measuring the gear backlash just did head in - I know its not complicated but in the end it was easier to press off/press on the gear...lol...plus a good excuse to buy a Hydrolich Press for the shed.  The local Dealership will do it for you as well, but charge $50 for the time.

    Double check ALL the threads on the cam cover as well - I had 3 of them stripped out and had to replace with TimeSert inserts - the best I have come across plus the kit works on the primary cover bolts as well.

    I stripped all clearcoat off my cover and polished the alloy up until it shone like chrome!  Once its done right and coated and looked after it lasts for years (unlike the clear which all stripped off on the front side from the road chit that got kicked up) 

    Remember to use chitloads of Assembley Lube when putting it all back together again.

    Here is the right style Cam Cover Gaskets to use (https://www.jamesgaskets.com/product/jgi-25225-70-xf/)
    Here is the wrong style gasket although it does fit okay it will piss oil out everywhere (https://www.jamesgaskets.com/product/jgi-25225-93/)
  • John.R Posts: 203
    Stock Poster John.R
    16 Jul 2017 10:12 PM
    Posted by tussuck on 16 Jul 2017 09:49 PM
    Measuring the gear backlash just did head in - I know its not complicated but in the end it was easier to press off/press on the gear...lol...plus a good excuse to buy a Hydrolich Press for the shed.  The local Dealership will do it for you as well, but charge $50 for the time.

    Here is the right style Cam Cover Gaskets to use (https://www.jamesgaskets.com/product/jgi-25225-70-xf/)
    Here is the wrong style gasket although it does fit okay it will piss oil out everywhere (https://www.jamesgaskets.com/product/jgi-25225-93/)

     

    Is the gear keyed so that it can't be put on incorrectly, or slightly out of time etc?

    As for the gaskets, ive got a loose one here that was in my sleeve with bike.


    Its the 'style' of the 'wrong one' but has the same holes as the 'right' one (notably the 2 seperate sections, and three holes on the left)

    Are you talking about style as in material, or the actual design of the gasket?



  • tussuck Posts: 1270
    Melbourne
    Performance Poster tussuck
    16 Jul 2017 10:43 PM
    Oddly enough they are not 'keyed' per sec but there are marks on the cam and gear that line up like a key.  

    So long as the new gasket is 100% the same as your old one your good.  Its not the material of the gasket nor the holes as they are the same.  Its the 'extra' bit of gasket material on the inside on the larger circle.  One has a small section of gasket material in the bottom left of the gasket and for the older Evos thats the important bit (I think I worked it out once that its to do with top breather vs bottom breather systems and in my case the old 86 Evo is a bottom breather.
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