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  • paulybronco Posts: 10489
    Forum Legend paulybronco
    07 Dec 2018 09:38 AM
    Quoting rodders on 06 Dec 2018 10:13 PMedited: 06 Dec 2018 10:13 PM
    Imagine if we had the Death Penalty here. They'd have to dig him up and resuscitate him.
    Quoting paulybronco on 06 Dec 2018 10:42 PM
    Well no as most inmates on death row appeal their sentences and Mokbel has only been in for 6yrs , the average death row inmate waits around 15yrs
    Quoting rodders on 06 Dec 2018 11:09 PM
    Then perhaps they can dig up Carl Williams and resuscitate him if it's found he shouldn't have been convicted in the first place.
    They are going to do better than that for his family if they find out he was wrongly convicted, you watch the law suites roll in 
  • rodders Posts: 5692
    Victoria
    Forum Legend rodders
    07 Dec 2018 10:00 AM
    Local councilors in Whittlesea shire want their CEO to resign as they are frightened that innocent people being caught up in any violent repercussions. Their CEO is Simon Overland, who was the Chief Commissioner of Police when these dodgy deals were done. 
    It gets more interesting each day. 
  • paulybronco Posts: 10489
    Forum Legend paulybronco
    07 Dec 2018 10:17 AM
    Quoting rodders on 07 Dec 2018 10:00 AM
    Local councilors in Whittlesea shire want their CEO to resign as they are frightened that innocent people being caught up in any violent repercussions. Their CEO is Simon Overland, who was the Chief Commissioner of Police when these dodgy deals were done. 
    It gets more interesting each day. 
    Great time to be a spectator......i would think that there are a fair few dodgy cops and legal eagles feeling a little nervous right now
  • Baloffski Posts: 1438
    Victoria
    Performance Poster Baloffski
    08 Dec 2018 03:54 PM
    Quoting rodders on 07 Dec 2018 10:00 AM
    Local councilors in Whittlesea shire want their CEO to resign as they are frightened that innocent people being caught up in any violent repercussions. Their CEO is Simon Overland, who was the Chief Commissioner of Police when these dodgy deals were done. 
    It gets more interesting each day. 
    Quoting paulybronco on 07 Dec 2018 10:17 AM
    Great time to be a spectator......i would think that there are a fair few dodgy cops and legal eagles feeling a little nervous right now
    Well, we would not know the half of it, PB. Not even a quarter of it and less...
  • fras67 Posts: 1
    Stock Poster fras67
    08 Dec 2018 06:03 PM
    Quoting paulybronco on 04 Dec 2018 02:32 PM
    So seems as though a  criminal defence lawyer who was being paid to represent several high profile crims was in fact dobbing them in to the cops. As a result these same crims may well see them set free and maybe even compensated by tax payers . This lawyer is now fearful of the fact that this double cross is now public and perhaps these crims may seek a payback. There are a few nasty characters been put away as a result of this info........i would be looking over my shoulder if i was her...
    I spoke to a senior legal figure, its Gobbo. The other woman, Garde was the person who blew the whistle on her.  That other woman is interesting as the legal profession kicked her out and now she's got them all back.  Go Garde.  She was the one who didnt wear a bra to court and had relationships with men of an alleged questionable background.

    Gobbo has left the country.

    I wouldn't be surprised if she doesn't make it to testify.  There are far too many people involved in this case.  It is alleged in the press that overland was overseeing informers and there are allegations against the current commissioner.

    If you read the media reports properly it is implied that Gobbo is not the only one. 

    Basically with all the underworld murders going on there was enormous pressure on police to put people behind bars and they have clearly engaged in highly dubious behaviour.  It is highly worrying that it looks like numerous prominent figures allowed this farce to go on.  People should be jailed.

    A royal commission has the power to upset people in positions of power maybe this will be like the inquiries into queensland legal system where it was established the police, and even judges were all pretty bent whilst Joh was premier.




  • paulybronco Posts: 10489
    Forum Legend paulybronco
    08 Dec 2018 06:27 PM
    Quoting paulybronco on 04 Dec 2018 02:32 PM
    So seems as though a  criminal defence lawyer who was being paid to represent several high profile crims was in fact dobbing them in to the cops. As a result these same crims may well see them set free and maybe even compensated by tax payers . This lawyer is now fearful of the fact that this double cross is now public and perhaps these crims may seek a payback. There are a few nasty characters been put away as a result of this info........i would be looking over my shoulder if i was her...
    Quoting fras67 on 08 Dec 2018 06:03 PM
    I spoke to a senior legal figure, its Gobbo. The other woman, Garde was the person who blew the whistle on her.  That other woman is interesting as the legal profession kicked her out and now she's got them all back.  Go Garde.  She was the one who didnt wear a bra to court and had relationships with men of an alleged questionable background.

    Gobbo has left the country.

    I wouldn't be surprised if she doesn't make it to testify.  There are far too many people involved in this case.  It is alleged in the press that overland was overseeing informers and there are allegations against the current commissioner.

    If you read the media reports properly it is implied that Gobbo is not the only one. 

    Basically with all the underworld murders going on there was enormous pressure on police to put people behind bars and they have clearly engaged in highly dubious behaviour.  It is highly worrying that it looks like numerous prominent figures allowed this farce to go on.  People should be jailed.

    A royal commission has the power to upset people in positions of power maybe this will be like the inquiries into queensland legal system where it was established the police, and even judges were all pretty bent whilst Joh was premier.




    Joh........??
  • rodders Posts: 5692
    Victoria
    Forum Legend rodders
    08 Dec 2018 11:40 PM
    Quoting paulybronco on 04 Dec 2018 02:32 PM
    So seems as though a  criminal defence lawyer who was being paid to represent several high profile crims was in fact dobbing them in to the cops. As a result these same crims may well see them set free and maybe even compensated by tax payers . This lawyer is now fearful of the fact that this double cross is now public and perhaps these crims may seek a payback. There are a few nasty characters been put away as a result of this info........i would be looking over my shoulder if i was her...
    Quoting fras67 on 08 Dec 2018 06:03 PM
    I spoke to a senior legal figure, its Gobbo. The other woman, Garde was the person who blew the whistle on her.  That other woman is interesting as the legal profession kicked her out and now she's got them all back.  Go Garde.  She was the one who didnt wear a bra to court and had relationships with men of an alleged questionable background.

    Gobbo has left the country.

    I wouldn't be surprised if she doesn't make it to testify.  There are far too many people involved in this case.  It is alleged in the press that overland was overseeing informers and there are allegations against the current commissioner.

    If you read the media reports properly it is implied that Gobbo is not the only one. 

    Basically with all the underworld murders going on there was enormous pressure on police to put people behind bars and they have clearly engaged in highly dubious behaviour.  It is highly worrying that it looks like numerous prominent figures allowed this farce to go on.  People should be jailed.

    A royal commission has the power to upset people in positions of power maybe this will be like the inquiries into queensland legal system where it was established the police, and even judges were all pretty bent whilst Joh was premier.




    Quoting paulybronco on 08 Dec 2018 06:27 PM
    Joh........??
    I don't know who Joh is PB but his wife made pumkin scones. You mark my words.
  • paulybronco Posts: 10489
    Forum Legend paulybronco
    09 Dec 2018 08:56 AM
    Quoting fras67 on 08 Dec 2018 06:03 PM
    I spoke to a senior legal figure, its Gobbo. The other woman, Garde was the person who blew the whistle on her.  That other woman is interesting as the legal profession kicked her out and now she's got them all back.  Go Garde.  She was the one who didnt wear a bra to court and had relationships with men of an alleged questionable background.

    Gobbo has left the country.

    I wouldn't be surprised if she doesn't make it to testify.  There are far too many people involved in this case.  It is alleged in the press that overland was overseeing informers and there are allegations against the current commissioner.

    If you read the media reports properly it is implied that Gobbo is not the only one. 

    Basically with all the underworld murders going on there was enormous pressure on police to put people behind bars and they have clearly engaged in highly dubious behaviour.  It is highly worrying that it looks like numerous prominent figures allowed this farce to go on.  People should be jailed.

    A royal commission has the power to upset people in positions of power maybe this will be like the inquiries into queensland legal system where it was established the police, and even judges were all pretty bent whilst Joh was premier.




    Quoting paulybronco on 08 Dec 2018 06:27 PM
    Joh........??
    Quoting rodders on 08 Dec 2018 11:40 PMedited: 08 Dec 2018 11:43 PM
    I don't know who Joh is PB but his wife made pumkin scones. You mark my words.
    Lol
  • JamesJ Posts: 418
    Stage 1 Poster JamesJ
    09 Dec 2018 07:30 PM
    Quoting rodders on 05 Dec 2018 07:29 AM
    Is she a hero for helping to lock away dangerous criminals or is she just as crooked as the rest of them?
    Whatever the case it has the makings for an interesting movie. 
    Quoting paulybronco on 05 Dec 2018 09:54 AM
    As a criminal defence lawyer her job is to defend the accused regardless how repulsive the crime and do the best for her client. The Crown prosecutor's job is to ensure that the evidence is consistent with the charge and ensure a conviction. The law has always operated on the premise that the crown and the defence rarely assist each other than when its beneficial to the defendant, eg dropping charges to agreeing to a guilty plea for a lesser charge, murder charge reduced to manslaughter etc. I am 100% sure this same laywer never said to her clients to tell police the whole story when they were interviewed as that would be appealed as legal counsel not being competent on the grounds that we all have the right to silence during questioning. 
    Your points on the respective competing(adversarial roles) of prosecution and defence are well made.The system would collapse if legal professional privilege was compromised.Advising a client about the existence of the right to silence is ,however , a very different type of advice to deciding tactically whether or not an Accused should  answer questions at a record of interview.As a general rule the advice would be name and address only.My estimate is that the advice to say fuck-all at interview would be about 97% of the time; sound advice.It is often the admissions of facts rather than of guilt itself that can make the conduct of a defence at trial unnecessarily difficult.In very  rare situations, however, a defence version offered at interview in response to police questioning can negate the need for the Accused to give sworn evidence at trial and be cross examined by Crown counsel as the exculpatory record of interview is admissible .
    ps I will add to this;a lawyer has an overriding duty to the court (even above the client) eg you can't lie/mislead the court for your client's benefit.You can be a gun lawyer who wins cases, fights hard and is brilliant ,but you can't be a fucking cheat! Legal practise is not a win at all costs process but is played hard but fair 
    In its purest form it is governed by ethics.I say purest form because like in any job there will always be individuals who ignore the essence of the job's requirements at the expense of the reputations of their peers. 
  • JamesJ Posts: 418
    Stage 1 Poster JamesJ
    09 Dec 2018 07:36 PM
    Quoting Mr.Mow on 06 Dec 2018 04:52 PM
    So now they’re saying mockbel and such may be released and eligible for compensation.. 
    wtf is wrong with this country?
    Quoting paulybronco on 06 Dec 2018 04:58 PM
    Perhaps its the correct thing to do here.......the evidence that put them there should not have been able to be used. Its a giant fuckup by the cops and roll over barrister. None of us believe that Mokbel and Co are innocent its the manner that the conviction was obtained was illegal
    Might be jumping the gun at this stage.Assuming the illegally obtained evidence is excluded,how much other evidence independent of the tainted evidence remains? There may be ample evidence to keep most of them in prison?  
  • Baloffski Posts: 1438
    Victoria
    Performance Poster Baloffski
    09 Dec 2018 08:19 PM
    Quoting rodders on 05 Dec 2018 07:29 AM
    Is she a hero for helping to lock away dangerous criminals or is she just as crooked as the rest of them?
    Whatever the case it has the makings for an interesting movie. 
    Quoting paulybronco on 05 Dec 2018 09:54 AM
    As a criminal defence lawyer her job is to defend the accused regardless how repulsive the crime and do the best for her client. The Crown prosecutor's job is to ensure that the evidence is consistent with the charge and ensure a conviction. The law has always operated on the premise that the crown and the defence rarely assist each other than when its beneficial to the defendant, eg dropping charges to agreeing to a guilty plea for a lesser charge, murder charge reduced to manslaughter etc. I am 100% sure this same laywer never said to her clients to tell police the whole story when they were interviewed as that would be appealed as legal counsel not being competent on the grounds that we all have the right to silence during questioning. 
    Quoting JamesJ on 09 Dec 2018 07:30 PMedited: 09 Dec 2018 08:46 PM
    Your points on the respective competing(adversarial roles) of prosecution and defence are well made.The system would collapse if legal professional privilege was compromised.Advising a client about the existence of the right to silence is ,however , a very different type of advice to deciding tactically whether or not an Accused should  answer questions at a record of interview.As a general rule the advice would be name and address only.My estimate is that the advice to say fuck-all at interview would be about 97% of the time; sound advice.It is often the admissions of facts rather than of guilt itself that can make the conduct of a defence at trial unnecessarily difficult.In very  rare situations, however, a defence version offered at interview in response to police questioning can negate the need for the Accused to give sworn evidence at trial and be cross examined by Crown counsel as the exculpatory record of interview is admissible .
    ps I will add to this;a lawyer has an overriding duty to the court (even above the client) eg you can't lie/mislead the court for your client's benefit.You can be a gun lawyer who wins cases, fights hard and is brilliant ,but you can't be a fucking cheat! Legal practise is not a win at all costs process but is played hard but fair 
    In its purest form it is governed by ethics.I say purest form because like in any job there will always be individuals who ignore the essence of the job's requirements at the expense of the reputations of their peers. 
    Wow James. You switched on, by one side or tother .
    As said by good self, say nought for is incriminating anything said. As often, last 20 years plus, police record, stuff. I'm not bad arse or good arse, just read a lot.
  • JamesJ Posts: 418
    Stage 1 Poster JamesJ
    09 Dec 2018 08:34 PM
    Quoting paulybronco on 05 Dec 2018 09:54 AM
    As a criminal defence lawyer her job is to defend the accused regardless how repulsive the crime and do the best for her client. The Crown prosecutor's job is to ensure that the evidence is consistent with the charge and ensure a conviction. The law has always operated on the premise that the crown and the defence rarely assist each other than when its beneficial to the defendant, eg dropping charges to agreeing to a guilty plea for a lesser charge, murder charge reduced to manslaughter etc. I am 100% sure this same laywer never said to her clients to tell police the whole story when they were interviewed as that would be appealed as legal counsel not being competent on the grounds that we all have the right to silence during questioning. 
    Quoting JamesJ on 09 Dec 2018 07:30 PMedited: 09 Dec 2018 08:46 PM
    Your points on the respective competing(adversarial roles) of prosecution and defence are well made.The system would collapse if legal professional privilege was compromised.Advising a client about the existence of the right to silence is ,however , a very different type of advice to deciding tactically whether or not an Accused should  answer questions at a record of interview.As a general rule the advice would be name and address only.My estimate is that the advice to say fuck-all at interview would be about 97% of the time; sound advice.It is often the admissions of facts rather than of guilt itself that can make the conduct of a defence at trial unnecessarily difficult.In very  rare situations, however, a defence version offered at interview in response to police questioning can negate the need for the Accused to give sworn evidence at trial and be cross examined by Crown counsel as the exculpatory record of interview is admissible .
    ps I will add to this;a lawyer has an overriding duty to the court (even above the client) eg you can't lie/mislead the court for your client's benefit.You can be a gun lawyer who wins cases, fights hard and is brilliant ,but you can't be a fucking cheat! Legal practise is not a win at all costs process but is played hard but fair 
    In its purest form it is governed by ethics.I say purest form because like in any job there will always be individuals who ignore the essence of the job's requirements at the expense of the reputations of their peers. 
    Quoting Baloffski on 09 Dec 2018 08:19 PM
    Wow James. You switched on, by one side or tother .
    As said by good self, say nought for is incriminating anything said. As often, last 20 years plus, police record, stuff. I'm not bad arse or good arse, just read a lot.
    Cheers Jertsy,
    Bear in mind that sometimes a court case can run for days or weeks.The media person ultimately writing up the story of how judges are too soft or crims get off lightly haven't sat in for the entirety of the proceeding.What the general public  are given the chance to read about a court case can sometimes be based on a small portion of what took place during that trial. As for being a good or bad arse we all have our moments, such moments rarely define us.We both ride Harleys so that's a good start.
     ps I've never been a copper :-)
  • Baloffski Posts: 1438
    Victoria
    Performance Poster Baloffski
    09 Dec 2018 08:39 PM
    JJ. cool man. Like your direction. 

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