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  • petebob Posts: 97
    Sunshine Coast
    Stock Poster petebob
    23 Aug 2019 09:53 PM
    Old Bob has turned 150,000km old this month, so it's time to give him a birthday. The last one he had was in 2014 when he turned 75,000. That entailed an upgrade to an SE 103 stage 3 kit, with SE cam plate & oil pump, compensator etc, thrown in for good measure. Research and experience has told me that the cam chain tensioner pads in these post '08 twin cams are good for about 80,000km, give or take - that's the reason for the birthday. Anyway, dropped it of with Bryan at Farrows Customs for him to deal with. Went in to see him after he'd stripped it down. To be honest, I wasn't sure what to expect. We've all heard the stories of scissored cranks, self destructing cam chests etc. Long story short.. crank run-out well within limits at 7 thou. Tensioner pads pretty much rooted (as expected), lifters good, cams starting to lose hardening on one lobe of the front cam and the others starting to show signs. Also some slight making on the cam plate made by the gerotor of the oil pump. Rockers, pushrods - perfect. Compression 200psi front and rear. So, things to do......

    Cam chain tensioners..going with S&S ones, good for 100,000km supposedly.
    Lifters... Fueling - just as good as S&S but not as costly.
    Inner cam bearings - unsure of replacement brand, but not stock HD.
    Cam chains...Fueling - again, S&S quality without the cost.
    Cams...the 103 stage 3 kit comes with SE 259e cams which I have been running and actually quite like. They lack a little bit down low, but get them in the band and they pull real hard to the limiter. On Bryans advice (he's an HD trained tech, so has seen a lot of how the SE quality has gone down over recent years), we've decided to go with S&S 585 cams. It's the same cam they put with their 106 kits, it'll handle the 10.5:1 compression no worries. 5 thou less lift and closes a little earlier, but should be fine.
    Had hoped to have everything back together on Friday, but Rollies fucked it up and sent pre-06 cam chains. Only got the right ones today, so hopefully will have the old boy back tomorrow. Looking forward to seeing if i can tell any difference with these cams. I somehow doubt it.
    Anyway, I just thought I'd share a little story about a high mileage bike. Bryan said that if I only did 5000km a year he would've told me just to replace the tensioners and bearings and it would last another 10 years.
    Goes to show the bad press about Harley is all bullshit. I'll let yas know how it all turns out.
  • steelo Posts: 2800
    Adelaide
    Forum Legend steelo
    23 Aug 2019 09:59 PM
    Good on you PB.
  • petebob Posts: 97
    Sunshine Coast
    Stock Poster petebob
    23 Aug 2019 10:43 PM
    Cheers Steelo.
    Maybe I just got a good one? Dunno, ya read through the internet, troll the forums, do your research and read a lot of negative shit. Look at the bike sales websites, see so many VERY low mileage bikes for sale, ya think...why??
    These bikes are fuckin awesome. Sure the handling isn't great and suspension, to be honest , is shit. But that's nothing a few dollars won't improve. Did we buy our Harleys to keep up with the Hyabusas or R1's? Fuck no. We just love our clunky slow old v-twins. No-one will ever persuade us otherwise.
  • paulybronco Posts: 12685
    Forum Legend paulybronco
    23 Aug 2019 10:46 PM
    Quoting petebob on 23 Aug 2019 09:53 PM
    Old Bob has turned 150,000km old this month, so it's time to give him a birthday. The last one he had was in 2014 when he turned 75,000. That entailed an upgrade to an SE 103 stage 3 kit, with SE cam plate & oil pump, compensator etc, thrown in for good measure. Research and experience has told me that the cam chain tensioner pads in these post '08 twin cams are good for about 80,000km, give or take - that's the reason for the birthday. Anyway, dropped it of with Bryan at Farrows Customs for him to deal with. Went in to see him after he'd stripped it down. To be honest, I wasn't sure what to expect. We've all heard the stories of scissored cranks, self destructing cam chests etc. Long story short.. crank run-out well within limits at 7 thou. Tensioner pads pretty much rooted (as expected), lifters good, cams starting to lose hardening on one lobe of the front cam and the others starting to show signs. Also some slight making on the cam plate made by the gerotor of the oil pump. Rockers, pushrods - perfect. Compression 200psi front and rear. So, things to do......

    Cam chain tensioners..going with S&S ones, good for 100,000km supposedly.
    Lifters... Fueling - just as good as S&S but not as costly.
    Inner cam bearings - unsure of replacement brand, but not stock HD.
    Cam chains...Fueling - again, S&S quality without the cost.
    Cams...the 103 stage 3 kit comes with SE 259e cams which I have been running and actually quite like. They lack a little bit down low, but get them in the band and they pull real hard to the limiter. On Bryans advice (he's an HD trained tech, so has seen a lot of how the SE quality has gone down over recent years), we've decided to go with S&S 585 cams. It's the same cam they put with their 106 kits, it'll handle the 10.5:1 compression no worries. 5 thou less lift and closes a little earlier, but should be fine.
    Had hoped to have everything back together on Friday, but Rollies fucked it up and sent pre-06 cam chains. Only got the right ones today, so hopefully will have the old boy back tomorrow. Looking forward to seeing if i can tell any difference with these cams. I somehow doubt it.
    Anyway, I just thought I'd share a little story about a high mileage bike. Bryan said that if I only did 5000km a year he would've told me just to replace the tensioners and bearings and it would last another 10 years.
    Goes to show the bad press about Harley is all bullshit. I'll let yas know how it all turns out.
    Brian is an excellent tech having worked for Jason and John Faithfull previous owners of Sunshine Coast HD . He does good work and wont send you on the wrong path.
  • petebob Posts: 97
    Sunshine Coast
    Stock Poster petebob
    24 Aug 2019 08:27 AM
    Yeah, he's good Pauly. So are Dane, Matty & Jason.
    We've been using him pretty much since he went out on his own.
  • Krash Kinkade Posts: 2817
    Forum Legend Krash Kinkade
    24 Aug 2019 09:42 AM
    Good on you PB well done!
    do it again!!
  • petebob Posts: 97
    Sunshine Coast
    Stock Poster petebob
    24 Aug 2019 04:41 PM
    I hope to, mate.

    Had a bit of a run through the hinterland today. I wasn't really expecting to notice much difference with the seat-of-the-pants dyno from the different cams, but it feels like I'm lacking a bit down low. Top end feels pretty much the same, if anything a little bit better, but below maybe 2500revs (guessing - no tacho) it just seems a little flat. 
    I'm still running the last tune for the 259e cams, so might hook the tuner up and do a few smart tune runs and see if that makes a difference. I know, I know. I should send it down to Fred at Procycle, but I just ain't got the coin.
  • Krash Kinkade Posts: 2817
    Forum Legend Krash Kinkade
    25 Aug 2019 07:49 AM
    Quoting petebob on 24 Aug 2019 04:41 PM
    I hope to, mate.

    Had a bit of a run through the hinterland today. I wasn't really expecting to notice much difference with the seat-of-the-pants dyno from the different cams, but it feels like I'm lacking a bit down low. Top end feels pretty much the same, if anything a little bit better, but below maybe 2500revs (guessing - no tacho) it just seems a little flat. 
    I'm still running the last tune for the 259e cams, so might hook the tuner up and do a few smart tune runs and see if that makes a difference. I know, I know. I should send it down to Fred at Procycle, but I just ain't got the coin.
    Have you checked how many pound of cranking pressure?
  • petebob Posts: 97
    Sunshine Coast
    Stock Poster petebob
    25 Aug 2019 10:52 AM
    Quoting petebob on 24 Aug 2019 04:41 PM
    I hope to, mate.

    Had a bit of a run through the hinterland today. I wasn't really expecting to notice much difference with the seat-of-the-pants dyno from the different cams, but it feels like I'm lacking a bit down low. Top end feels pretty much the same, if anything a little bit better, but below maybe 2500revs (guessing - no tacho) it just seems a little flat. 
    I'm still running the last tune for the 259e cams, so might hook the tuner up and do a few smart tune runs and see if that makes a difference. I know, I know. I should send it down to Fred at Procycle, but I just ain't got the coin.
    Quoting Krash Kinkade on 25 Aug 2019 07:49 AM
    Have you checked how many pound of cranking pressure?
    No, I haven't, Krash. Whats your thoughts? Advice?
  • fatbat Posts: 2888
    Forum Legend fatbat
    25 Aug 2019 12:20 PM
    The Se259 cam has a late intake closing event so it's gonna be soft down low unless you've got high compression (recommended 10.8:1) or more displacement. 
  • petebob Posts: 97
    Sunshine Coast
    Stock Poster petebob
    26 Aug 2019 09:23 AM
    The 259e came with the stage3 kit. 10.5 : 1
    I wouldn't have called it "soft" down low.
    A few more k's up on the s&s 585 yday and seems to be going ok. The slight differences I'd noticed seem to be negligible really.
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